(THIS IS ACTUALLY THE FIRST BLOG ON THIS SUBJECT - MY THINKING A DAY LATER IS POSTED IN THE BLOG BEFORE THIS ONE - CONFUSING? I WILL ALSO POST JUST THE CONCLUSION OF THIS ONE AS A SEPARATE BLOG AS WELL IF YOU JUST WANT THE MAIN POINTS)
Well this is tough!
(This is far too long – if you just want the main points, go to the two page conclusion near the end before the final three pages of an appendix; if you want a one concise paragraph, go to the three bold sentences at the end of that conclusion):
There is a prophetic word circulating around Christchurch that on Sept 28 there will be another significant earthquake, involving water and drownings. The following is trying to be an accurate summary of content not sarcastic or mocking: The reason for this earthquake is that God’s patience has run out with Christchurch, he is angry because of its sin and people are so hard-hearted that God is resisting the attempts to rebuild and he needs to send another disaster to break our spirits so we will turn to God which will usher in a great revival. In the meantime God’s people should pray with deep concern, though things are so bad that people will not repent so God will not relent but we can be greatly comforted that God will look after his people through this and our prayers will nurture this revival the other side of the disaster.
This message has gone viral. Well for many what they have heard is that someone has predicted a big earthquake with death and drowning on September 28 and that this has been checked by significant groups and accepted and the word has been confirmed by others. Some maybe by default dismiss this kind of thing. But many people are very fearful and others are very concerned about loved ones and they are weighing up what to say to them and how. There is also a sense of “oh no, please God, no more.” The effect or impact has been to produce fear, distress and confusion about what to do. For some it has perhaps emboldened witness to friends and family and introduced an intensity and fervency into their faith and a sense of the sovereignty of God, the seriousness of sin and the call to repentance.
Such a word also easily taps into the sense that maybe we have compromised the holiness and transcendence of God and defaulted to a liberal wishy-washy faith that God is nice and tolerant of whatever we do and that we have become weak on sin. This kind of word tends to produce prayer, repentance, and zeal. There is also a fear that to question this word would be terrible if it then proved to be true – that people I could have warned might die! And that I would be found to have opposed God and exposed myself as spiritually out of touch with God, as part of the weak false compromised church.
Many have asked leaders for some help in how to respond to this “word”, basically looking for a sense of “is that from God, therefore it will happen and I am terrified and I need to tell people” or “no it’s not from God so, whew, I can relax”.
Now I don’t know the people behind the word or what churches and networks they are involved in and accountable to. I don’t know the groups they say they have submitted this word to for checking and discernment and who have in turn affirmed it.
Also I must say I haven’t had a great sense of conviction about responding to this word. Personally I don’t have a clear sense of God speaking to me on this. So I would much rather say nothing. However I have had a number of people seeking guidance on this so I believe the leaders of the church in Christchurch (well at least those of us who have people who are exposed to this) do need to respond and provide some leadership and pastoral guidance at this time. So we just have to do the donkey work of evaluation. For reasons that I will explain I do think it needs to be evaluated within a leadership framework.
So it’s a pretty big deal. This really does call for a thoughtful, discerning, wise, gracious, humble and rigorous and prayerful response.
First to put my response in context let me step into this murky subjective world of what I believe I have heard from God through all of this: This might sound weird but I along with some others felt that there would be a second significant earthquake. But after the February earthquake I felt God was present to bring “recovery” - that that was the clarion call that needed to be sounded to give the people of God a clear sense of direction and purpose – God wanted to be with us to recover and then to be part of the city recovering. I wrote about this but felt I needed to submit it to those who lead the Christian organization I work for and they agreed that I could put it out there. I also felt that someone who had prophesied that the second earthquake was judgement on the church was in fact wrong. About a month ago some prophetic people said they felt that God was calling his people to speak peace to the land. That resonated with me and I have felt peace as I have prayed for the land to settle again. I do believe that the earthquake has rocked people at a very deep level and potentially opened them to the gospel and that churches need to find a way to speak the gospel into that condition, to bring the good news that we are created to live in loving dependence on God and find security in him, that God is the answer to the trauma and terror of feeling so small and vulnerable and out of control. However there is also a sense that as people begin to rebuild and regain a sense of power that we must also speak a message that says God created you to be in the world in his image creating, leading and building but do it with him not independent of Him. That is the Genesis 1 and 2 Creation mandate. I sense God is using this whole disaster to stir the church from slumber, to awaken boldness and passion and that something really wonderful could come from all of this as we embrace the challenge of rebuilding this city – the prophetic words about a wonderful revival in Christchurch could actually come to pass out of this. There is a sense that the church wrestles with apathy, that it has lost its confidence and boldness in talking to people about God and lost its passion for building Christ’s church. Such prophecies as the one circulating tend to stir up these kinds of issues. Recently I felt that what God would say to the church in Christchurch is “I love your heart for the lost” because it reflects God’s heart and therefore our mandate which is to win the lost not to condemn them. So for me talk of a third big earthquake is disturbing and at the very least has to somehow be integrated within this sense of God bringing recovery - unless I got it completely wrong! The main conviction I have is that this should be evaluated within a leadership framework.
So how do we respond to a word like this?
I. The place of prophecy in New Testament faith and life
A. Testing and weighing
Some could easily write-off the whole area of prophecy as too messy, unpredictable, nutty and bizarre. The apostle Paul advocates a different approach:
1 Cor 14:29 Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said.
To weigh diakrino is to separate, judge, or weigh: it implies discerning what is from God and what perhaps comes from the human heart whether from good human desires or fallen perspectives (less frequently from a demonic spirit).
So a word like the one currently circulating would involve more than just a stamp of yes or no but a sifting of elements.
Commenting on this verse one scholar Garland states, “The assumption is that the prophets do not speak with unquestionable divine authority. The congregation is not to accept everything that is said just because a person claims to speak under the influence of the Spirit. The prophet’s words invite appraisal and discussion (Grudem 1982: 66–67). This is quite different from ascertaining whether the individual is a true or a false prophet (Baker Exegetical Commentary on 1 Corinthians, 662). Garland goes on to make the following points:
“Prophets must allow the content of their revelation to be tested in the community and may need reminding that their “prophecy” is only partial and temporary (1 Cor 13:9–10).
“They are not to regard themselves as infallible and unanswerable to the church body.
Another commentator on the passage (Witherington) says:
“It is not like Old Testament prophecy, which was to be applied, not sifted, and had a “Thus saith the Lord” sort of authority. Christian prophecy has an authority of general content, for “we prophesy in part” (13:9)… And the judging here should not be confused with Old Testament rules about judging false prophets. Here it is the prophecies, not the prophets, that are being weighed.”
There is some ambiguity in this passage as to who the “others” are who weigh the word – the other prophets or the others in the congregation. But what is clear is that New Testament prophecies do not carry the sense of authority of Old Testament prophecies. Part of the reason for this explained below is the already –not yet nature of life in the spirit – 1 Cor 13:9, “we know in part, we prophesy in part.”
In a similar passage Paul says:
Do not treat prophecies with contempt. Test everything. Hold on to the good. Avoid every kind of evil. (1 Thessalonians 5: 20-22)
The concept of testing is of proving genuine and the image of refining – separating the gold from the dross.
Gordon Fee is a Pentecostal Bible scholar. He believes one of the biggest weaknesses of the charismatic movement is that there is not a process of weighing words claimed to be from God.
On the other hand the command to not treat prophecies with contempt shows how easy it is to write-off the whole area. Paul’s answer is to sift and hold on to the good. I wonder what the good is in the current prophecy circulating?
B. Parameters of prophecy
1. Edification, exhortation and consolation
In 1 Cor 14:3 Paul gives the general purposes of prophecy as to strengthen, encourage and comfort. Many people believe that people should not stray outside these areas. Some believe people functioning and recognized more as prophets rather than in personal prophecy may move beyond this.
R. Loren Sandford in “Understanding Prophetic People” is an example of someone within the prophetic movement giving guidelines for this ministry so I will quote from him as an insider. He also considers purpose as edification, exhortation and consolation. Exhortation is defined as stirring things up and for calling individuals and churches to specific action.
In terms of weighing up this word it does not easily seem to fall within these parameters – not even exhortation in that it does not seem to seek specific action to avoid the prophesied consequences. We are exhorted to pray but that will not avert the disaster. Having read it numerous times it is actually at heart closest to a word of comfort to God’s people – this really bad thing is going to happen and your reaction is fear but don’t worry God will look after you through it.
2. Perhaps Admonition and Watchman
Loren Sandford also includes “admonition” which he defines as “to call to account for sin.” However he points out “because the true prophetic word reflects the heart of God, who is love, it includes a way out and a promise of redemption and blessing”. This word suggests that despite the call to prayer there is no way out from this disaster – that is not normal admonition.
Prophecy is not prediction of events but a call to action. In the Old Testament context they lived within a covenant that defined specific consequences for obedience and disobedience so prophets announced “if you keep doing this thing, then this promised negative consequence will happen but if you change and do what is required then this promised blessing will come.” People’s behavior then could change the outcome i.e. if they changed then the bad thing did not happen and the good thing did. See Ezekiel 18.
Sandford also speaks about the role of watchman i.e. seeing the future and proclaiming it in order to prepare God’s people. Perhaps this is where this word sits? But how should we prepare?
3. Limitations and Boundaries
Sandford says he limits prophetic ministry to those who have demonstrated a degree of maturity and reliability and “we add some rules that basically boil down to: ‘No direction, correction, dates, mates or babies’( 225). Got that: don’t prophesy dates! Now that is an important point, that ordinarily the setting of specific dates is out of order. Why might that be?
4. Timing
That simple statement by Sandford indicates that a prophetic word that named a specific date is way outside the normal parameters of prophecy.
You see timing, as opposed to general principles, is the most complex part of prophecy. Just look at how often the fulfillment of Old Testament prophecies was far more complex and different in timing (and nature of fulfillment) to what people assumed.
And timing was not the point. Prophecy is not a horoscope or prediction in itself. It is forthtelling the word of God to people with a call to respond as we live by faith not sight. In fact I suspect that Jonah’s forty days is the only example of a precise dating and even there forty is a number full of symbolic significance and precisely is a case where response changed the predicted disaster. Even Jesus admitted he did not know the precise timing of events:
Mark 13:32-33 “No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. Be on guard! Be alert! You do not know when that time will come.
The reason is that the timing is not the issue – the issue is the call to response in light of the fact that this thing is going to happen sometime. E.g. if we knew a date for a flood you could just leave town for the day and then come back and carry on as before. If you are warned about a principle and a future general path then you reconsider your priorities in life in light of that.
Even from a purely scientific point of view it is highly likely that there will be more shakes, even strong ones, so even without specific predictions it would be wise to be prepared. For example one expert suggests having supplies at home to enable you to survive 72 hours. That’s just common sense response to general knowledge and probability.
However you do not have to look far in history to see how powerful it is when Christians believe they know a date for a supposed act of God, normally the end of the age. Nothing motivates Christians more – at best because of real concern for their loved ones and with a revised set of values as to where their priorities now lie. The most recent one was the Bible teacher Harold Camping who predicted that the Rapture would occur on May 11, 2011. Remember the clear arguments as to why the world would end in the year 2000? Fear has motivated many towards sacrificial mission and bold witness and actually got many started on their journey into the kingdom of God. Unfortunately the events do not occur. Something in us leaps at that stuff!
But back to this word and timing… So we can say that setting a specific date is outside the ordinary parameters of prophecy.
And so we are forced to acknowledge that a word that sets a date would indeed be an unusual word derived from an extraordinary level of prophetic authority and standing and significance.
5. Riddles, dark speech, partial prophecy
I think part of the reason for care around those kinds of issues is the clear teaching that prophecy has an element of mystery to it.
Numbers 12:6-8
“When a prophet of the LORD is among you,
I reveal myself to him in visions,
I speak to him in dreams.
7 But this is not true of my servant Moses;
he is faithful in all my house.
8 With him I speak face to face,
clearly and not in riddles;
he sees the form of the LORD.
Why then were you not afraid
to speak against my servant Moses?”
Moses is contrasted with other prophets – the implication is that they do not see clearly but rather in riddles, visions and dreams.
Add to this 1 Cor 13:9-11 and we see mystery. This explains why Paul may have needed to say “don’t treat prophecies with contempt” i.e. they are usually so obscure that it is easy to despise them. You see ultimately, “we live by faith, not by sight” 2 Cor 5:7
6. according to faith
Paul advices that people prophecy according to their faith
Romans 12: 6b If a man’s gift is prophesying, let him use it in proportion to his faith.
It recognizes there are appropriate boundaries to the level at which someone prophesies. Generally in this area distinctions are made between a gift or prophecy and people functioning more as recognized prophets.
7. witnesses
Another key principle is that God confirms his word through two or three witnesses. The standard advice would normally be to leave a word on the shelf until God confirmed it by several others saying the same thing. So I would like to know – who else has God been speaking to about this? I have to put my hand up and say not me. In fact I regard this principle as key to a wise response to this word.
The following verses refer to Jewish legal testimony but many regard this as a wise principle of discernment.
· Deuteronomy 17:6
On the testimony of two or three witnesses a man shall be put to death, but no one shall be put to death on the testimony of only one witness.
· Deuteronomy 19:15
One witness is not enough to convict a man accused of any crime or offense he may have committed. A matter must be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.
I don’t think it is good enough for one person to get several confirmations – I think we expect to hear a word of such magnitude through several people.
8. leadership
The really key issue particularly in charismatic churches is the relationship between prophetic people and leaders. Often people have an Old Testament model of prophets as the spiritual remnant battling against godless leaders. Paul suggests a model of prophets as secondary and submitted to apostolic leadership.
1 Corinthians 12:28
And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues.
1 Corinthians 12:29
Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles?
Ephesians 2:20
built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.
Ephesians 3:5
which was not made known to men in other generations as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to God’s holy apostles and prophets.
Ephesians 4:11
It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers,
Again a prophetic person Sandford says “New Testament prophets serve under the Church’s established leaders and authority structures.” Sandford gives the example of the prophet Agabus in Acts 21;10-11 who gives a word to Paul and Paul considers it and continues his planned course of action. “Agabus simply transmitted prophetic information, rightly leaving it up to Paul to decide what to do”
This model is tremendously liberating because it frees prophets to submit what they are saying but then leave it there.
I would suggest that the process of discernment, testing, weighing and ultimately the planned course of action lies with leaders leading the movement of God’s mission in the context.
My experience has been in charismatic circles there is often a sense of prophets as the hot line to God and leaders surrendering their leadership to prophetic people.
Prophets submitting to leadership also creates an appropriate order that Christianity and the church is a movement to grow to touch the nations of the earth. Apostolic leadership is graced by God to lead that. Prophets feed into that but do not lead it.
I would suggest that we interpret any prophecy within the wider parameters of the call of God on the church in the world.
Such missional leadership also sets a perspective of the theological vision. God loves the world, Jesus gave his life for the world, God commissions his people to go into all nations with good news, and bring in a harvest and one day there is a final judgement.
Such a missional framework should be our default framework not a truncated Old Testament view which sees the righteous prophet denouncing sinful people and announcing impending judgement. That reflects a particular moment in Old Testament history and taken as a basic framework leads to distortions.
II. The worldview of the prophecy and understanding and handling correctly the big picture of Scripture:
As I read the prophecy the basic worldview is of a holy God who has been patient with stubborn proud sinful people and though he has compassion on them, is now stirred to act in wrath, that God needs to break the spirit of Christchurch before people will turn to God and that the world is heading towards a fearful end but God can get us through that.
I must admit the first time I read this it tapped into that sense of mediocrity, fear of being lukewarm etc. But then I think hold on … is God on a personal crusade against our city? Are we really that bad compared to others? And then Japan with its earthquake and tsunami... does that mean that northern Japan and Christchurch have particularly angered God? If you think it through the logic simply does not work.
I also find the conclusion a bit confusing. There is a dreadful event coming so we should pray but our prayers won’t change it because people’s hearts are so hard. But we will be safe in God and afterwards people will turn to God. This is not an apostolic spirituality of mission.
So what is the purpose of the word? There are a set of scriptures that reinforce that it will be ok for Gods people. And so the message is pray – something dreadful is going to happen, it is inevitable but as we pray the prayers will help bring a revival afterwards and we will be safe through this. The author offers some pastoral help at the end revealing her own fears about the end-times scenarios but that God had shown her God will look after his people through disasters.
What we need to look at is our understanding of the big picture of Scripture , how different parts fit and where we stand in the ongoing story of God’s action in the world and our basic convictions about how God relates to the world.
A. Old Testament prophecy and wrath
Again all the Scripture passages come from Old Testament particularly prophets (except Heb 11 which refers to Old Testament people) who functioned within a particular framework of enforcing the Sinai covenant towards a nation heading towards receiving the promised curses of disobedience.
Now Jesus modeled something quite different.
In Luke 4 when Jesus quoted from Isaiah 61 he stopped halfway through the verse – announcing the day of Gods favour and leaving out the day of the vengeance of God.
This is important theologically.
Jesus absorbs current wrath of God on himself at the cross, launches a redemptive mission focused on good news, liberation, healing and apparently postponing judgement until a final day.
In Ephesians 2:3 Paul acknowledges that we are children of wrath. The next sentence in vs 4 is “BUT God, being rich in mercy and having loved us with a great love…” The passage goes on to tell about the amazing things God has done out of his love for us who deserve his wrath. In light of the cross God is pouring out his love on those who by nature deserve wrath. That certainly is true for me, so why not the rest of Christchurch?
B. Judgement on Cities
Jesus announced judgement on cities but in terms of the final day of judgement Matt 11:20-24.
20 Then Jesus began to denounce the cities in which most of his miracles had been performed, because they did not repent. 21 “Woe to you, Korazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! If the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. 22 But I tell you, it will be more bearable for Tyre and Sidon on the day of judgment than for you. 23 And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted up to the skies? No, you will go down to the depths. If the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day. 24 But I tell you that it will be more bearable for Sodom on the day of judgment than for you.”
Jesus consistently speaks about judgement especially of cities in terms of this final judgement at the end of the age. Currently we live within a missional dynamic of the church preaching salvation, not announcing present judgement.
C. Present mission of grace and spiritual salvation
Jesus’ parables reinforce this sense of a present mission of grace and a future judgement. Eg the parable of the wheat and tares indicates that judgement happens by the angels at the end of the age (Matthew 13:24-30; 36-43) as does the parable of the net (Matthew 13:47-50). Present mission embraces the vulnerability of some rejecting our message but some accepting it.
It is true that Jesus prophesies judgement of Jerusalem (Matthew 24). However this represents a very unique event in salvation history related to the cross and the shift to focus on the gathering of a spiritual people of God through mission.
Luke 19 shows Jesus weeping over the city with regard to future judgement:
41 As he approached Jerusalem and saw the city, he wept over it 42 and said, “If you, even you, had only known on this day what would bring you peace—but now it is hidden from your eyes. 43 The days will come upon you when your enemies will build an embankment against you and encircle you and hem you in on every side. 44 They will dash you to the ground, you and the children within your walls. They will not leave one stone on another, because you did not recognize the time of God’s coming to you.”
(Also depending on your interpretation of the Book of Revelation John may have announced judgement on the contemporary city of Rome.)
D. Future final judgment
This concept of future judgement is clear in Scripture:
Romans 2:5
But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed.
Hebrews 9:27
Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment,
2 Peter 2:9
if this is so, then the Lord knows how to rescue godly men from trials and to hold the unrighteous for the day of judgment,
Revelation 14:7
He said in a loud voice, “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water.”
In fact in this church age, Jesus is at work with churches, Revelation shows him tending churches and according to 1 Peter 4: 17: For it is time for judgment to begin with the family of God; and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God?
Present judgement focuses on churches not cities or nations.
It is important to also understand God’s future judgement as not the ultimate reality. It is penultimate and the means to God finally removing sin and setting up his restored and renewed creation. The Book of Revelation says you will be blessed if you read it (Rev 1:3). However many people are terrified when they read it which suggests they are reading it wrongly. It ends with the removal of sin and the establishment of peace.
E. Our attitude to the world: Concern and care and mission
This kind of intercessory prophetic worldview sees a biblical worldview as focused on sin. The apostles however model a different view:
Acts 14:
14 But when the apostles Barnabas and Paul heard of this, they tore their clothes and rushed out into the crowd, shouting: 15 “Men, why are you doing this? We too are only men, human like you. We are bringing you good news, telling you to turn from these worthless things to the living God, who made heaven and earth and sea and everything in them. 16 In the past, he let all nations go their own way. 17 Yet he has not left himself without testimony: He has shown kindness by giving you rain from heaven and crops in their seasons; he provides you with plenty of food and fills your hearts with joy.”
This shows that God’s basic strategy is of kindness and his providence preserves and supplies. He looks for gratitude, acknowledgement, worship, submission and relationship.
Paul reinforces this:
Romans 2:4
Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, tolerance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness leads you toward repentance?
According to Paul God’s wrath is at this time manifest not through active punishment but through a handing over to the consequences of sin. Actually it is a retelling of the story of Genesis 3. Three times in Romans 1 Paul talks about God handing people over to face the consequences of their sin:
Romans 1 (It’s a bit of a long passage!):
18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.
24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31 they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.
The other important thing here is that the kinds of things people often assume are provoking God’s wrath are actually the result of God’s wrath i.e. that he has handed over people or taken his hands of protection off people committing the foundational sin of idolatry so they might see the effects of denying God.
(And obviously it needs to be put in context of the surprising flip that happens in chp 3 and 5 parallel to Eph 4:4 where in spite of this being what we are like, God loves us and so has saved us!)
Paul’s speech in Athens provides an interesting model of relating to culture. Paul felt a spiritual distress at the idolatry he saw but he also saw positives in their religious quest and he worked with that. He models complexity in the way we see culture and context – positive and negative.
Acts 17: (another long passage!)
16 While Paul was waiting for them in Athens, he was greatly distressed to see that the city was full of idols...
22 Paul then stood up in the meeting of the Areopagus and said: “Men of Athens! I see that in every way you are very religious. 23 For as I walked around and looked carefully at your objects of worship, I even found an altar with this inscription: TO AN UNKNOWN GOD. Now what you worship as something unknown I am going to proclaim to you.
Paul models this capacity for a nuanced view of the world: I see negatively distressing idolatry but I also see positively religious hunger. And I choose to begin my message not with my prophetic repulsion at idolatry but with my apostolic, evangelistic, pastoral and teaching point of connection to gather people.
Paul goes on to call people to acknowledge God:
24 “The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live. 27 God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’
Notice he is able to find positive points of connection with their culture and writings within their culture – it’s not all evil and dark out there!
Paul does then introduce the concept of judgement and repentance:
29 “Therefore since we are God’s offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by man’s design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.”
Paul like Jesus announces a future judgement and a present age of grace and salvation.
A Biblical worldview holds in tension four elements:
· Good - Creation
· Bad - Fall
· New - Redemption
· Final - Completion
To overemphasise any one of these leads to distortion. Evangelicals and Pentecostals have traditionally emphasised the bad fall and sin with a minimal sense of the new in redemption and underestimated the original good creation, the true power of the new and the final completion of God’s work.
III. Conclusion:
The Biblical view of natural disasters is complex. Fundamentally they are part of the order of things in a good but fallen creation awaiting renewal and liberation (Rmns 8). To analyze specific events as the direct result of sin and judgement is to make the mistake of Job’s friends who only bring condemnation and it is to read all Scripture incorrectly through the lens of the specific context of the Old Testament prophets enforcing the Mosaic covenant. My reading of the New Testament is that God is not bringing judgement against cities but is commissioning his people to be agents of his redemption throughout the world, sharing the good news, planting and growing churches, and being salt and light in the world.
There is something incredibly psychologically powerful about the sense that we are caught up in an apocalyptic scenario where God is specifically acting in powerful ways in our context. Actually that perspective has some positive spiritual benefits – of passion, prayer, concern for others, dealing with sin etc etc.
However I think there is a fundamental distortion and therefore error in the intercessory prophetic movement when it is not aligned with and submitted to what I would call apostolic missional leadership i.e. a tool in the Father’s work of evangelism, church planting and societal transformation. It tends to overemphasize sin, prayer and judgement and underemphasize action in the world for good and God’s grace. It is a passive, reactive, separatist and very intense form of spirituality.
So I would make the following points:
· I do not agree that the earthquakes should be viewed as acts of God’s judgment against Christchurch.
· I do not accept as biblical the idea of the inevitability of God’s judgments
· I believe the Bible emphasizes a future final judgement for the world and cities and a present mission of gospel proclamation of grace and salvation, with a call to repentance, and therefore a willingness on the part of Christians to live with a present vulnerable mission that can be rejected
· I do believe God is using the situation of the earthquakes to awaken the church from slumber
· I believe this prophetic word clearly positions itself outside the normal parameters of a prophetic word, adopting a position that if authentic would represent an extraordinary authority, clarity and specificity of insight
· I believe we are warranted in expecting God to confirm such an unusual word that violates the usual suspicion of directional prophecy and precise dating.
· I believe the Christian movement needs to be led by missional leaders, leading a movement of gospel initiatives
· I acknowledge that the reaction this word provokes stretches people towards some biblical themes. It signals many values that should be there anyway in light of the more general truths regardless of the specific prediction – anyone could die at any time and there is a future final judgement: SO dealing with sin, heartfelt prayer for our city, humility before the holiness and majesty of God, boldness in sharing with our loved ones, passionate involvement in God’s mission, seeking to find rest and security in God, seeking closeness with God, desiring to hear his voice and obey… those are all good things that so easily slip away or lose their intensity in apathetic, comfortable slumber. It is helpful to have those stirred up. So thank you!
· I believe the worldview of the prophecy actually suggests some distortions of a biblical worldview particularly overemphasizing wrath, judgment, intercession and evil in the world and underestimating the impact of the cross, and thus the present age of church, grace and spirit-filled mission and the commission to a mission of positive harvest and growth and transformation.
· I acknowledge that the prophetic and intercessory movement adds something important to balanced ministry in the church. However I would suggest such prophetic people need to be in close relationship with apostolic, pastoral, teaching and evangelistic ministries (Eph 4). In particular they need to find their functioning within apostolic leadership of God’s mission in our city and province and such partnerships will in fact significantly alter the dominant ethos of the movement –towards mission, harvest, grace and growth rather than a remnant theology of the faithful praying about the inevitable judgement on sinners.
· I believe that such a word should have been submitted to significant, recognized, godly leaders in the city and unless there is multiple witness to it, it should be shelved awaiting confirmation.
This seeks to take seriously a person of God putting out there what they believe they are hearing from God (Good on them!) but also my responsibility to weigh it and to listen to the church weighing it, my understanding that any word will be a mixture and reflect a person’s theological framework while also acknowledging my own limited framework and seeking to make sense of it all in the light of Scripture and to offer pastoral advice on how to respond.
So unless a number of key mature recognized leaders say either that yes God has also spoken to them of another major earthquake coming soon OR they say this word witnesses with them, then:
1. I will embrace the call to passion, prayer, turning to God, finding security in God and urgency of mission and I will seek to take my part in the further awakening of God’s church in Christchurch.
2. I will reject the emphasis on present judgement and wrath and the interpretation of the earthquakes as judgement (because I believe God’s mode of operation between Jesus bearing his wrath of the cross and the final judgement is God sending his people in gospel proclamation of salvation).
3. I will ignore the specific details of prediction and leave them on the shelf requiring further confirmation for such an out of the ordinary, specific date-setting prophecy, knowing that I am not responsible to act on just a single “word”.
(PS SEE "DEVELOPING THOUGHTS" BLOG ON WHAT TO DO IF I THINK IT MIGHT BE GOD!)
I think that is about the wisest course of action I can come up with right now. What about you?
IV. Appendix: Notes on the sections of the document
A. The “Look out” website statement:
Totally agree that “words” need to be weighed
BUT there is no indication who the people are behind the website who have weighed this word!
B. Intercessors poem:
Totally agree on the importance of compassionate intercession, and it does acknowledge that God would rather forgive than punish.
BUT actually it is God who looks for, initiates and by his Spirit moves his people to pray – just as the Father sent the son. It is not intercessors who initiate compassionate prayer before an angry God. The Spirit groans within the hearts of intercessors.
It has framed relationship to the world totally as God seeing sin and coming in punishment.
The tension between love and judgement is within the heart of God and actually love is more foundational to God.
C. Prophetic:
A number of church leaders in Christchurch felt God spoke to them about a second earthquake. Personally I don’t know of any leaders that God has spoken to about a third major quake. If you do please tell me. In fact about a month ago a number of prophetic people felt led to speak peace over the land and seek the stilling of the shakes. That certainly resonated with me. That is obviously opposite in intent to this word – the battle of the prophecies!
Malachi 1:4-5
4 Edom may say, “Though we have been crushed, we will rebuild the ruins.”
But this is what the LORD Almighty says: “They may build, but I will demolish. They will be called the Wicked Land, a people always under the wrath of the LORD. 5 You will see it with your own eyes and say, ‘Great is the LORD—even beyond the borders of Israel!’
In context this is about final destruction of the nation of Edom. I guess the simplest point of comparison is that though the city tries to rebuild God will demolish the rebuilding. However the reason in the text is that this is “a people always under the wrath of the LORD”.
This may be an out of context pointer to a second earthquake.
Amos 3:6-8:
“If a trumpet is blown in a city, will not the people be afraid? If there is calamity in a city, will not the Lord have done it? v7 Surely the Lord God does nothing, unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets. A lion has roared! Who will not fear? The Lord has spoken! Who can but prophesy!”
The Question sounds very clear: If there is calamity in a city, will not the Lord have done it?
Actually in context it is the final of a series of questions and in that section actually the answer to the questions is not clear. The point seems to be the need for prophetic interpretation of events.
However we need to seek a biblical theology of disasters i.e. seek to integrate all the passages. The whole book of Job demonstrates the mistake of seeing a direct causal link between sin and experience. Jesus suggested it was a mistake to see disasters as direct punishment for sin.
Right after the event of that 6.3 major earthquake, the Lord spoke in my heart and said to me "There is more to come yet."
Well I guess it comes down to an embarrassing and undignified battle of prophecy because the day after the earthquake I felt God’s presence under one key word “recovery” – that God was present to bring recovery and that we needed to get on board with recovery. There was a prophetic word that the second earthquake had come as judgement because the city had not responded in gratitude and celebration for the miraculous preservation of life. I definitely felt a prophetic anointing and God saying that person was wrong.
Even if the earthquakes had been judgement I felt the heart of God was shown in Isa 40 – that even there where disaster was explicitly from judgement that after the judgement Gods heart was to comfort his people.
The Lord has also spoken to me and said "I have been patient for a very long time, but now My wrath is kindled."
In Luke 4 Jesus quotes Isaiah 61 but break off halfway through a verse: announcing the day of god’s favour but leaving out the day of God’s vengeance. This implies that in the church age God is not brining judgement but salvation.
This theme is picked up again in Eph 2 which declares that we are by nature children of wrath but God, being rich in mercy, and having loved us with a great love” instead brings salvation.
I find it easy to get caught up in this but then I think hold on are we really that much worse than every other city in the world. There is a kind of conspiracy theory mentality that likes to find a sense of significance and rationality to life by seeing us as part of some central act of God.
So some time later Japan suffered a tsunami so Christchurch and northern Japan are the really evil places in the world where God’s wrath is poured out – and everyone else is ...???
Also, the Lord spoke to me yet again, and said "When the spirit of Christchurch is broken, the city will become "Christ's Church".
Well that could be true and fits with theme.
I asked the Lord with tears if the things he has shown me needed to happen. The impression I received was that the peoples' hearts were so hardened that it would become necessary yet again to bring judgement before a change would happen.
So what is the purpose of this word if not a call to avert disaster which is he standard response of the people of God in scripture.
“I have been asked "Why would God show us these things?" My answer has been, that even when judgement is due, God delights to show mercy. God is love. He is the same, yesterday, today and forever. With Him there is no shadow of turning”
So what are we praying for???
D. Vision from the Lord:
During the early 1990's when I was living in Christchurch, I saw an inner vision. In this vision, Jesus was up on the hills above Christchurch. I saw a close-up of His face. He was weeping. He began to walk down the hills, until He had walked into the centre of the city, into The Square. He continued to weep, the tears rolling down His face. The tears formed first a pool, then a river, then the river began to flow through the suburbs of Christchurch. I had the impression that as the Body of Christ wept in intercession for Christchurch, the river of God would flow in revival through the city.
Others have had a vision of Jesus weeping over the city of Christchurch. In context to be fair that is about impending judgement on Jerusalem.
But that was a moment in salvation history and now the role of the people of God to be agents of redemption – to pray and work for shalom.
E. A word for the body of Christ
Do not think that you will escape My judgement if you continue to ignore Me...
Do not think that you will escape My judgements if you ignore Me.
Acts 17:31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.”
I don’t think God is particularly focused on bringing present judgement to Christchurch. Judgement is future and he is living patiently with lots of other godless cities. Jonah 4 shows his heart is of concern for cities. God is doing something in Christchurch bringing great good out of this bad.
